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Linker seems not to respect EDID color depth setting

 
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Colin Hunt



Joined: 26 Sep 2016
Posts: 9

PostPosted: Sun Dec 11, 2016 4:20 pm    Post subject: Linker seems not to respect EDID color depth setting Reply with quote

Panasonic 700 UHD player, playing a 4K UHD HDR Blu-ray disc, connected via Linker (0.16 fw) to a Philips 7101 HDR UHD TV.

I tried to use Linker to force Panasonic player into outputting 10-bit colors instead of 12-bit colors. While Linker seems to communicate color space correctly, EDID's color subsampling and bit depth are ignored:



Instead of 8-bit color depth 12-bit colors are used. Player also reports outputting 12-bit colors. Color subsampling goes in and out as 4:2:2 instead of 4:2:0 as mentioned on EDID title.

I also tested one of the Special EDIDs from the EDID collection .zip file. It was supposed to enable 10-bit colors, 4:2:0 subsampling, HDR and BT.2020 color space. Linker passes 12-bit colors, 4:2:2 subsampling, HDR and BT.2020 from player to TV.

There's an option in Linker Utility's Scaler section > Advanced Setup that lets me choose output Deep Color setting. Selecting 10-bit colors here results in Linker downsampling incoming 12-bit colors to 10-bit and outputting 10-bit colors to TV. But player is still outputting 12-bit colors when the aim was to force player into outputting 10-bit colors.
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CHUN



Joined: 01 Jan 1970
Posts: 3664

PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2016 12:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi there

The panasonic does not output 10 bit at all so it cannot be forced to as per
https://www.avforums.com/threads/panasonic-dmp-ub900-player-severe-banding-macro-blocking-issues-with-12-bit-4-4-4.2042886/

Only the samsung k8500 outputs 10 bit to my knowledge.
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Colin Hunt



Joined: 26 Sep 2016
Posts: 9

PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2016 1:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's interesting. This article appears to disagree:

http://www.hdtvtest.co.uk/news/dmpub700-201612114390.htm

"After some clarification, Panasonic insists it’s doing nothing wrong: its 4K BD players are merely obtaining the EDID from said displays, and returning 8-bit, 10-bit or 12-bit output based on the EDID info."
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admin
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Joined: 16 Dec 2010
Posts: 489

PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2016 4:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

All of this is absolutely normal,

You have selected a 4K60 4:2:0 8b EDID, so player will try to output 4K24 4:2:2 12b since he is seeing a 300MHz limited sink !

So 3 things here:

1. if you want 4K60 4:2:0 8b output, then set player TO NOT USE 24fps !!
2. OR you can simply edit the 4K30 preset on Linker and set it to 8b if you need that.
3. OR you can use custom edid 4K30 8b max and then player won't try to send deepcolor.

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Colin Hunt



Joined: 26 Sep 2016
Posts: 9

PostPosted: Tue Dec 13, 2016 10:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I can set the player to output 8bit colors in its Setup menu; that's not an issue, nor the goal.

The goal is to make the player output 10bit colors. That setting is not available in player Setup menu.

I only used the 8bit EDID to check whether it can force the player from 12bit colors to 8bit colors.
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admin
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Joined: 16 Dec 2010
Posts: 489

PostPosted: Tue Dec 13, 2016 7:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Then please take a screenshot that reflect the state when you are trying what you want to achieve or your goal (with the right EDID then)

If the goal is to output 10b, then use 4K60 4:2:0 10b EDID.

at 4:2:2 you will always have 12b that's normal.

i don't think the player can output 10b at 4K30 4:4:4 neither

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Colin Hunt



Joined: 26 Sep 2016
Posts: 9

PostPosted: Fri Dec 16, 2016 8:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

admin wrote:
Then please take a screenshot that reflect the state when you are trying what you want to achieve or your goal (with the right EDID then) If the goal is to output 10b, then use 4K60 4:2:0 10b EDID.




EDID loaded: Integral-custom-4k24-420-10bit-hdr-bt2020-3D-stereo.bin

I don't have an EDID for 4K60 4:2:0 10bit so I used that one from Integral EDID Collection.
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CHUN



Joined: 01 Jan 1970
Posts: 3664

PostPosted: Sat Dec 17, 2016 12:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Please post screenshot of your scaler section settings on the linker.


Colin Hunt wrote:
admin wrote:
Then please take a screenshot that reflect the state when you are trying what you want to achieve or your goal (with the right EDID then) If the goal is to output 10b, then use 4K60 4:2:0 10b EDID.




EDID loaded: Integral-custom-4k24-420-10bit-hdr-bt2020-3D-stereo.bin

I don't have an EDID for 4K60 4:2:0 10bit so I used that one from Integral EDID Collection.
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admin
Site Admin


Joined: 16 Dec 2010
Posts: 489

PostPosted: Sat Dec 24, 2016 2:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Colin,

No this is not good, first of all, the TV is 4K60 4:4:4 capable and HDR10 capable on it's HDMI2.0a input.

When you posted you said you are trying to force panasonic player into outputting 10b color instead of 12b colors.

So first of all, why using a 4K60 4:2:0 8b EDID or why using a 4K24 4:2:0 10b EDID ? all those are limited to 300Mhz and your TV can do up to 600MHz on it's HDMI2.0a, so please confirm the reason for that ?

If you are not sure, fine, here is our recommendation:

- Use Linker latest firmware 0.17 actually.
- Once flashed it comes with full HDR capable EDID by default on custom slot.
- Player will output 4K60 4:2:0 10b for HDR or 4K24/25/30 4:4:4 12b (based on its 24fps settings)
- then you can convert this into what ever you want. just tell us exactly what timing you are looking to reach and we will give you exact instructions













PS: EDID won't help you for 8b / 12b really, i mean it's not like you select a signal and you get this ... in fact it can appears to work, for ex, you select 4K60 4:2:0 8b and then player will try to match this resolution listed as main in EDID, but if you set player to HDR or something, then player as it sees a 300MHz EDID, he will try to send you HDR within 300MHz and therefor move to 4K24 4:2:2 12b which allow HDR within 300MHz, as you see, you are then far away for the 4K60 4:2:0 8b you initially wanted to set.

The right way to do that is usually to allow at least what display allow, so if display is hdmi2.0a, you need to use one of the first edid or the default one that allow everything. Then you will get the max possible signal for HDMI2.0a and there you can start to make modifiction if you need to change color depth or chroma or downscale, but those are not EDID manipulation anymore, they are done though scaler section of GUI (or via quick set preset)

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