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[nikostsaltas]

[schmoe]

Greetings HKMod, et. al.,

I have discovered a new issue with my rev3 HDFury2. I am getting jitters/shakiness in my image when I use a custom 1080p60 timing.

When I output a standard 1080p60 timing from my video processor (vp) there is no jitter. However, on my CRT projector a standard 1080p timing results in a shifted image that is cut off on the left side. The workaround is to adjust the front/back porch settings via my vp. The HDFury2 doesn't seem to like any custom timing, and I've tried dozens of different timings (more info here). It may work fine at first, but eventually the image will start to jitter.

Here's a video of what the jitter looks like. I put a piece of masking tape with a black vertical line on the screen to give a reference point for the jitter.

Why do I think the HDFury2 is causing the jitter?

1. When I output from the VP's RGBHV output instead of HDMI, the picture looks pristine. I can change and customize resolutions as much as I want and the jitter doesn't appear.

2. I still have my rev1 HDFury2 around, and guess what happens when I hook the rev1 up instead of the rev3? The jitter behavior is different - in fact it's "mostly" gone. Instead of a constant left-right shaking, it jumps left-right a tiny bit once every 3-to-5 seconds.

3. If I switch the colorspace output on the VP from RGB to YCbCr, then the image gets *really* nasty. Things start to distort. Check out this video. I don't think anything but the HDFury2 could cause this, correct me if I'm wrong. It can't be the cables, especially when YCbCr is a lower bandwidth signal to begin with (right?). The HDFury2 has to do more "work" to convert YCbCr to RGB and this is the result. I suppose it could still be the VP, but that seems exceedingly unlikely to me, especially when analog output works fine.

Known issue? If this is a defect in my unit or fixed in a later revision, how do I go about getting a replacement?

Thanks,
Joe

[schmoe]

It looks like HKMod isn't checking in as often as he used to. Is there a more direct line for support issues?

[HKmod]

Hi Schmoe, don't worry we are always around

We have done lot of work on firmware and we have solved everything you reported.
Service for firmware reprogramming will be announced in the next days by UserName.

Also, we have solved BTB/WTW without loose of color depth upscale feature ! :thumbsup:
This can be done on earlier revision through a fix + firmware reprogramming.
We have yet to determine if we will release a new version and then swap some older units or offer it as upgrade service through a partner in North America as most of our customers are located in North America.

Also if the firmware reprogramming service and/or WTW/BTB upgrade service is running well, we will prolly offer similar service in Europe and Asia.

Details shortly !

[schmoe]

Sounds like you guys have been busy making progress. Good good!

This jitter issue is a real deal breaker for me - I'm looking forward to the upgrades.

[jd213]

Hi,

My processor (DVDO VP50Pro) can output YCbCr (4:4:4 or 4:2:2) or RGB over HDMI. Which should I use when outputting RGB with the HDFury2?

I would guess the answer is RGB, but since my processor natively processes video in YCbCr 4:2:2 it will convert RGB and 4:4:4 input sources to 4:2:2 before output, I figured it's possible the same could apply to the HDFury2.

Sorry if this has already been covered, I couldn't figure out how to search for individual posts in long threads.

edit: Oh, I see that I should send RGB regardless since doing otherwise will clip BTB/WTW. Still mildly curious if the HDFury2 does any internal colorspace conversion and back when sending RGB, however.

[HKmod]

All depends the type of media you are playing, best is to have various setup for various media (Movie/Computer/Gaming Console/TV/...)

I suggest you read this excellent article as basically it's a calibrating question, you can also create your own thread with your configuration/setup and media used then share your experience and results.

http://www.audioholics.com/tweaks/calibrate-your-system/hdmi-black-levels-xvycc-rgb

[HKmod]

[jdbt3027]

OK....I'm back on the forums, and a bit frustrated with this product (HDFury2). Please help me understand this....

I purchased an HDF2 V2 back in November of last year. Thought is was a great product, and definately needed in my setup but while using component output, I kept having the blanking issue, so I resorted to using the RGB output because it didn't have the blanking issue. I wasn't the only one, as there were a few people on this forum having the same problem.

There was a modification done, and the HDF2 V3 started shipping. This was supposed to fix among other things, the blanking issue. I traded the V2 for the V3 and tried again, same problem. I had to go back to RGB to get around the issue.

Then we were told that the problem was with the power supplies, and that the new power supplies would solve the problem. I was told that since I was ordering a GammaX module, I should use its power supply instead. Tried it and still got the blanking problem with component output, so it's back to using RGB.

Then I read the power supplies are still an issue, and that 3rd party power supplies are the way to go. I read in the forums that Belkin adaptors have fixed the problem for some of the users. I go out and buy about 4 different Belkin USB adaptors, and a couple from Radio Shack for good measure. Still blanking is an issue.

I then read it could be the HDMI cable I'm using, so I buy a few different ones to try. The blanking of the screen is still an issue. Back to using RGB. I figure I'd give it a while before I come back to the forum to see if anyone has figured out a solution. I started thinking maybe it's my equipment/setup, so I'd continue using RGB for a while.

I come back after about 3 months to see if blanking is still an issue, or if it's just me. Then I see there are new component cables being offered as a possible fix, and there is a firmware upgrade that I again have to pay money for (as well as ship the product to Canada for a few weeks). And I'm hearing that these changes also help with the blanking issue.

username/HKMod:
My question is....does anyone really know what the problem is? Can someone please explain it to me? I've invested in the HDF2 and GammaX products since November 08, and I'm still not sure why this thing has this annoying blanking issue.

I guess I'm also frustrated in the fact that after paying for the HDF2 and the GammaX products, I have to again pay for a firmware update to get the product working the way it should have worked when I bought it. Yes the price is minimal, but I'm not understanding the logic. Also, what happens if I still have the blanking issue after the firmware upgrade? Will I be receiving the updated set of component cables with my order for the update? Has there been another update to the power supply, and if so will I need one of those too?

Sorry for the rant, but I'm confused about what hardware I should have at this point, and after 5 months I still have a product I can't properly use. What do I do? Am I one of only a few people still having issues with screen blanking? Have you all been able to replicate the problem in testing to know what's really going on?

BT

RPTV: Pioneer Elite 710-HD
Blu-Ray/DVD: Panasonic DMP-BD55

[HKmod]

Dear sir,

It would be extremelly helpfull if you can give us the state of the led while you experience blanking.
In any case, the 1.5x firmware will more likely solve intermittent blanking you still have (feel free to post your feeling on the matter once you got the firmware upgraded unit tested), if you have preordered the product initially, please check your PM.

[jdbt3027]

[HKmod]

Dear sir,

Don't worry, we received your details and Paypal ID by PM,
please check email or PM in a day or so and you would then have shipping informations and tracking informations available.

[HKmod]

Brian Dipert, senior technical editor from EDN.com reviewed HDfury2 here:
http://www.edn.com/blog/400000040/post/130043213.html

Since his review, HDfury2 ran his path to wikipedia's HDMI page
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HDMI

"There are devices called HDCP strippers which can remove the HDCP information from the video signal and allows the video to be playable on non-HDCP compliant displays.[100] An example of an HDCP stripper for HDMI is the HDfury2 which can convert the video to VGA or component video and the audio to stereo analog or digital TOSLINK.[101][102]"

PS: HDfury is not CONVERTING anything, HDfury is DECYPHERING the signal using their very own licensed hardware parts with paid royaltees and embedded HDCP keys on them !

[HKmod]

[schmoe]

Hi HKMod,

Thanks for looking into this. Since you're sending me a replacement I'll try to keep this short and just wait to see if the new unit fixes the issue.

You quoted a couple things I said in a different thread. Ignore them. I was just starting to diagnose the problem and reported what I saw at the time. The truth is the jitter always comes. Switching resolutions isn't the only trigger. It will come if I leave it on long enough. Or simply power cycling everything will cause it to appear.

Also, the other thread had at least two examples of the timings I was using. Did you try them out?
H-Shift: 356, H-Front: 110, H-Sync: 44, H-Back: 356, V-Shift: 38, V-Front: 9, V-Sync: 5, V-Back: 28
H-Shift: 276, H-Front: 4 , H-Sync: 227, H-Back: 276, V-Shift: 36, V-Front: 4, V-Sync: 5, V-Back: 36

My source is a DVDO VP50Pro. I have a hard time believing that a $3500+ piece of equipment would be the cause of these issues, especially when so many other DVDO owners on this forum run custom timings for their projectors and don't have this issue (most are using the Moome input card). And yes, I'm running the latest firmware.

Finally, as I pointed out in my previous post the behavior of the jitter is actually DIFFERENT between my rev1 and rev3 HDF2, so that seems to strongly suggest the the Fury is causing the jitter. The rev1, in fact, is actually BETTER and has less jitter than the rev3. Hopefully this just means I have a faulty rev3. I've gone back to using the rev1 for now.

Looking VERY forward to the updated unit.

-Joe

[AnalogRocks]

Wow with all these digital signal timing issues remind me again why we just don't use analog?

[schmoe]

Because analog was made by the devil, it rips holes in the space time continuum and it causes cute puppies to be slaughtered.

Just paraphrasing the HDCP spec.

[HKmod]

Hi Schmoe,

As you said, let's see the results on replacement unit but when you state "most are using moome". sorry but that's not true, most of people are using HDfury and HDfury2 which is prolly due to its cost and most of people are reporting better contrast, sharper picture and better color with HDfury. And no one (apart from you) ever reported any jitter aka video chop because those are (in our opinion) strictly due to the source operation with custom timing.
Now, to be fair, it's also true that a few said that moome gave better results in their setup, i have read that somewhere here or on AVS.
I'm also wondering if you are using custom timing to get RGB centered and if you don't have jitter with standard timing/resolution, why don't you go through a Box RGBHV centering unit first ?

Still, it would really help if you can try others sources and/or another display.

We haven't tested your custom timing yet, actually i missed it from the other thread, but once you report the same issue with the replacement, we will of course test it.

[schmoe]

HKMod,

Yes, the custom timing is to help fix the image cutoff that happens with Marquee's and 1080p timings. What does a centering device do? Doesn't it just change the timings as well?

I can try hooking my HTPC up directly and send custom timings through it. That's a good idea. But all my other devices don't support custom timings (e.g. BluRay player, Denon receiver) and they all work fine at 1080p (including my DVDO). I'll let you know.

Thanks,
Joe

[HKmod]

It depends the scenario and the true cause of the jitter.
If it's your source producing those video chops with custom timing and if your source @ 1080p standard timing gave no jitter, then using external Box product for RGB centering will more likely solve your issue.

My 2 cents is that it's prolly badly done on digital when non integral number are interpreted (non integral number coming from custom timing used). Doing it on the analog side should bypass such issue.